A-grade = no flatwork?

[dizzy]

I had to crack a smile when Storm and I were watching a video she'd bought called A Lesson With Ludger Beerbaum.
Here he had a couple of riders ranging from olympic qualifiers in show jumping to eventing, all dressed to kill with horses to match. Well, I thought this was going to be a joke, I mean what on earth can he teach them? Surely they are all on the same level. WRONG!
At first he put a rather low, simple cross up with a placing pole at 2.7m in front, and the same after the jump. The whole idea was to TROT the horse over the pole and then over the jump and TROT out over the second placing pole. Sounds simple enough, crikey, even Vader and I do that just about every day. I just about fell off my chair (nope, hadn't hit the vino yet ;D) when I saw this lot trying to comply with his instruction. It ranged from one horse bolting over it, one catleaping, another using it as bounces...not ONE single horse/rider combo could quietly trot in, jump and trot out. Seems these riders think trotting is a rather unnecessary evil and should be avoided at all cost. This tape was a real eye opener and I have to say I was rather proud of myself and Vady Vades after seeing these "experienced" riders and horses run afoul of a simple trotting exercise....

[chateauleorage]

I agree with what you are saying. People tend to forget that a balanced and supple horse that can collect, extend, etc. will in the long run turn out to be a much better horse to jump as all his muscles have been build correctly and strongly. There are some A-grades out there who just nail their horses to jump huge fences all the time without taking the time to do the basics. (NOT EVERYONE! But I know of at least one as I used to stable at his yard.) I have ridden some of his horses and thought wow! now I am going to sit on a well-schooled animal, and BOY! was I shocked to realise that my little E-grade was much much better schooled and definately more supple!!

[Stripes]

I've heard about it, apparently it's a really good video.Where did she get it from?

[RhiannonOset]

hmm glad I was trawling through here. I've said for ages that a little basic flat schooling wouldn't harm anyone. *is a dressage freak* hehehehe and even then a mediocre one. Still I'm not averse to a jump now and then and having aquired a half lease on a horse who doesn't mind Dressage but goes ape when it comes to jumping (out of pure love of it) what's a girl to do BUT let him have some fun.
The thing is he's been out of work for so long and I refused to even pop him over anything before we'd done a few months of schooling just to make sure he's all together ... and even now I think we're rushing hehehehe. Flat work flat work flat work!! It makes for a much more 'balanced' ride in more than one sense of the word.
I'm fortunate to be riding a maniac who doesn't really give a whatsit about what's in front of him - as long as he's facing it in some manner he'll go over it. Bless his little white sox. *smiles*
At the moment he's good on the right rein but insists on bolting about on the left ... we've put it down to him feeling a bit unbalanced and feeling that he needs to get oomph to get over an 18" jump!! heheheheh Still this brings me to the balance thingywhatsit ... I'd much rather have a horse that is balanced physically and mentally so that I can enjoy going about and doing a course. Comfortably without having to yank on him to get him to slow, and without having to practice my limpet skills whilst imagining my horse is a rock and clinging to his neck while he just generally rides me. I have found that flat work pays off huge dividends. A horse that does some basics is more likely to be able to collect himself and extend himself and turn sharp corners in a speed jumping competition than the one who turns like a plank of wood and who just races about because all sense of control is lost due to a lack of general schooling. Also if horse is balanced in all ways, the rider becomes confident and this helps stop the run outs and refusals.
Ask Arwen ... Her beasty jumps like a tank! I love that mare - she's a bit nutty by my standards for jumping (nervous #1 here) but she's goes - she never refuses or runs out unless she or Arwen have made a serious error of judgement ... normally she's honest and scopey. Arwen has decided that really, despite the mare's abhorrence for flatwork, it must be done (even if she has to con the mare into thinking it was entirely her idea and her rider had nothing to do with it hehe). The improvement on the flat is amazing after only a month and a bit of schooling once a week and letting the mare have her jumping fun the rest of the rides. I missed her performance at the little show on Sunday ... but I know that apart from a slight miscalculation at one jump the courses were good and mare was behaving. Now what I would love to see is this mare improve her already awesome jump just after some flat work. That would just prove a point!!
I'll defo be going to look for this video as I have lots to learn and relearn about jumping ... particularly now with the maniac.

[Salinero]

Did anyone read the article with Tossy in the latest HQ? I like the one exercise that she did in a square ... would like to try it someday.

[AJ]

Hectic....yet true.....when I rode with Gonda as a Junior well that's where I learnt my lesson....Didz being the little (as Dizzy would put it) Kalahari Ferrari would come into a jump and well you just sat there....my fault because I trust her endlessly and left it up to her....anyway so Gonda tunes me "jump this cross AT a trot and halt".....well it was 60cm's if that and Didz ultimately stopped nose-over-fence about ¾ of the arena away from the jump! Anyway we get to try again....no such luck....Gonda tell me to get off and she gets on....well Didz still tought she was buggering off when Gonda corrected her in her "error"....that was valuble....I still to this day do that with ALL my horses....Didz still to this day (rode with Gonda 10yrs ago) can canter a 1.2m and halt immediately after landing.....one prob is I concentrate to hard sometimes and she stopped with me mid combo once....but flatwork is everything in my training even changing to eventing.....the suppleness that it gives your horse is worth it and having control over the animal is better than hoping and praying for the best! ;D

[Salinero]

I often see Lisa Williams warmup at shows ... jumps C grade, stops dead about 2-3 strides after the jump, then looks back to make sure she is still dead center in the middle of the jump. Hectic!

[AJ]

I try not to do that in the warm up anymore....my horse's brake light are faulty!

[Zoltan]

I rode Lisa Williams horse Jariwa once, after she had her car accident. All I can say is he was a school master at the age of 5. Absolute pleasure on an outride. I have wanted to steal him ever since.

Wasn't allowed to jump him, only hack him a couple of times. She does school her horses very well. Never cruel to them, and does it all without gadgets. My friend works for her. Lovely person - and take note, almost the only person I know that consistently produces A-grade showjumpers.

Like I said it is all down to flatwork.

[Salinero]

Gereva (sp) is standing at MRC at the moment and I also know the girl that works for her! Small world.

[Zoltan]

I used to lease this girls horse, Zoltan "Bumble" when I was stabled at Waterloo with Liz Hattersely, that is when I met her.

Thanks - now I know where to steal him. Just down the road from me!!!! hehe.

"Jerry Jaws" (my nickname for him) must be quite old by now. Have you seen Lisa's warmblood stallion. The pitch black one. He is to die for!!!!

[Salinero]

The stallion is called Rosco and yes, he is lovely!

[Chalkie]

Sal that little exercise almost killed me on Friday, but it was two squares, ridden in a figure of 8, about 70cms high, in three strides, then in four, in three in four...the straight in then from corner to corner. Another little exercise mmm how to explain, two uprights 5 strides apart, about 5m away another 2, 5m apart then with two uprights in the middle at an angle...that exercise upright to upright u jump in 4,5,6 strides then angling the jumps in the middle jumping straight, leg yielding to straighten up for next fence and then across again...around and the whole diagonal thing again maybe i should try to draw diagram and then around and two uprights again at the end which you have to jump in the same striding as you jumped the first two uprights
*has confused herself terribly

[michelerotheray]

Re: Dizzy's thread on Ludger Beerbaum's video, firstly my comment would be that international A Grades do not trot but canter around a course so therefore why work on something you are not generally going to use (this would probably be why their horses are not used to it)? I dont see the point ! Secondly I think Tossy is brilliant but a running rein freak, if you watch her jump carefully you will see that her horses have been trained with running reins and I feel that when a horses head is restricted they naturally drop their front legs (not so good for show jumping). Anyway I think she's done very well even with the running reins !

[AJ]

because it's good training that's why.....